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 LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?

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giejoe
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MessageSujet: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Dim 31 Mai 2015 - 21:02

In attending the CSSA annual general meeting we had the opportunity to follow up on the changes to Bulletin 72 with both the CSSA and Minister Blaney's office. Unfortunately we learned that Murray Smith (Manager, Specialized Firearms Support Services, Firearms Investigative and Enforcement Services
Directorate, Canadian Firearms Program, RCMP) was heard referring to this as "The Year of the Magazine" at CANSEC just days ago. Allegedly this is a reference to an ongoing effort by the RCMP to limit LAR-15, Beowulf, and similar magazines' use. It is expected that whatever changes they intend to implement in order to obtain the goal of sidelining these magazines' use will be rolled out mere weeks ahead of the upcoming election. Minister Blaneys' office and the CSSA both overheard these comments at CANSEC, are aware of the RCMP's intentions, and are working towards preventing it. We will also be filing further Access to Information requests and following up with both the CSSA and the government as the situation develops over the summer.
In short, it appears that the RCMP are working towards placing restrictions on magazine use that would prevent the use of LAR-15 and Beowulf magazines, either completely or by legally requiring those magazines only be used with LAR-15 and Beowulf rifles. When we asked "Does this mean we may not be able to use our ten round magazines in out regular AR-15" we were told that indeed, this effort by the Firearms Program would prevent us from doing that, if it comes to fruition.
Update: The rumour that the CSSA is proposing 10 round magazines as a potential solution to this predicament is false.

C'est paru sur calibre ...

D'apres vous ?
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1clickdown
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Dim 31 Mai 2015 - 21:06

Il va falloir modifier le règlement qui découle de la loi sur les armes à feu sur la capacité des chargeurs, en reliant le chargeur et l'arme dans laquelle il est utilisé.
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Libertarian Shooter
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Dim 31 Mai 2015 - 21:12

C-42 était pas supposé empêcher la GRC de nous mettre des bâtons dans les roues comme sa? J'espère que les Conservateur vont intervenir.
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1clickdown
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Dim 31 Mai 2015 - 21:16

La GRC ne peut pas modifier un texte légal.
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gunguru
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Dim 31 Mai 2015 - 21:23

Wow, la petition de la NFA pour enlever toute restriction de chargeur a vraiment étée utile... Rolling Eyes

_________________

Je suis hoploïnomane et fier de l'être.  Tous ensemble contre Hoplophobie!

Membre des organisation suivantes
CSSA - CCFR - NFA - NRA - CFI - PCC - SFC - IPSC - FQT
Tous Contre un Registre Québécois Des Armes à Feu

http://extreme-precision.forum-2007.com
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peter527
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Lun 1 Juin 2015 - 7:40

la grc vas surement esseillier en cours contre un voyou qui vas avoir de multiple chef d`accusation et le chef contre le chargeur ne sera pas la priorité de sont avocat se qui vas causer préjudices (si le juge le condamne)
la grc a deja changer le texte de l`interprétation sur la partie concernant les mag lar15 c`est sur qui vont s`esseillier a suivre
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1clickdown
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Lun 1 Juin 2015 - 8:05

...le voyou aura certainement des chargeurs prohibés.


Par contre, le texte règlementaire est assez clair...

3. (1) Tout chargeur qui peut contenir :

a) plus de cinq cartouches du type pour lequel il a été initialement conçu et qui est conçu ou fabriqué pour servir dans l’une des armes à feu suivantes :

b) plus de dix cartouches du type pour lequel il a été initialement conçu et qui est conçu ou fabriqué pour servir dans une arme de poing semi-automatique qui est habituellement disponible au Canada.


Le chargeur est un dispositif par lui même, prohibé ou non prohibé, il n'y a rien dans le texte qui fait rapport à l'utilisation de celui-ci dans un type d'arme différent...

Je voudrais bien voir le procureur qui va présenter ça en Cour.


http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/fra/reglements/DORS-98-462/TexteComplet.html
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BoomSticK
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Lun 1 Juin 2015 - 14:38

l;a GRC  essaie de ressortir une ancienne recommandation fais par un comité spécial du report du BILL C-80, 1991


RECOMMENDATION 24
The Special Committee recommends that the Department of Justice, in
consultation with the Canadian Advisory Council on Firearms, develop regulations
defining the scope of the term “device”, and the criteria pursuant to which a power
to prohibit “devices” by order—in—council would be used. The Special Committee
further recommends that the regulations be made “subject to affirmative
resolution of the House of Commons” pursuant to section 39(1)(b) of the
Interpretation Act
.
6.

AMMUNITION MAGAZINE SIZE LIMITS
The Minister of Justice has announced that the government intends to prohibit large
capacity ammunition magazines used in semi-automatic firearms, under the power which Bill
C-80 would grant to prohibit “devices”. The proposed limits are 10 for all handgun
magazines, and 5 for centrefire long gun magazines. The limits would thus not extend to low-
velocity, low-calibre rimfire rifles such as the standard .22 calibre. The Minister advised the
Special Committee, however, that no firm decision has yet been made on the precise limits
and the criteria for their application.

Perhaps no other single issue was more controversial than this one in all of the hearings,
particularly to hunters and competition shooters. The government’s concern is with the rapid-
fire capability that large capacity magazines give to any semi-automatic firearm. The Minister
suggested that magazine limits were an alternative to prohibiting or restricting semi-
automatic firearms entirely. The Minister’s view is that large capacity magazines have no
legitimate hunting or sporting use, and that they pose a danger to public safety. It was noted,
for example, that Marc L~pine used two 30-round magazines in his rampage at the Ecole
Polytechnique, and it was suggested by the representatives of the families of the victims of
that tragedy that the death toll might well have been less if only smaller magazines had been
available. It was also strongly argued by the Minister and the victims’ families that the effect
on hunters and recreational shooters of the proposed magazine limitations would be both
reasonable and minimal.

The Special Committee is sensitive to these concerns, and sees no legitimate reason for
the availability of magazines in the order of 30-round capacities. We are concerned, however,
that the prohibition approach suggested by the Minister might not be workable and
enforceable, and that the limits proposed would unduly hamper the legitimate activities of
some classes of firearms users.
Much of the opposition to the government’s proposal centred on the specific limits suggested.
Concern was expressed with the effect of the limits on rifles with built-in magazines of a
capacity over 5 that could not be altered and could thus become effectively prohibited.
Although the Department of Justice suggested that hunting rifles with built-in magazines of a
capacity of more than 5 are uncommon, they do apparently exist, and it was not clear what the
extent of this presumably unintended effect would be. While the limits could be applied only
to detachable magazines, this would produce anomalies that could undermine the rationale for
the proposal.

Competition shooters argued that most competition shooting involves magazines of a
capacity greater than the proposed 5 and 10 limits. The International Practical Shooting
Confederation, in particular, asserted that such limits would shut down many of their
activities. They stated that they use 10 to 17 round magazines in their competitions, and that
many of the more modern handguns that they use have magazines with more than 10 rounds.
Other witnesses charged that the proposed limits would simply be unfeasible as
proposed. The limits are based on whether the magazine is intended for a handgun or a long
gun, and some magazines are interchangeable. The Department of Justice asserted that such
magazines are rare and could be separately dealt with, but so long as the problem of
interchangeability exists there will continue to be anomalies and problems of interpretation
that could place legitimate firearms users in unnecessary criminal jeopardy. Future
developments in both firearm and magazine manufacturing could also exacerbate the
problem.

Magazines are also unmarked and thus untraceable. This would make enforcement
difficult, and it would mean that distinctions could not be made on the basis of certain
magazines being registered as restricted. No method apparently exists at present for
identifying particular magazines so as to make such distinctions. Mr. Murray Smith, the
firearms expert from the R.C.M.P., acknowledged that the problems of interchangeability and
untraceability, compounded by the several million ammunition magazines that are already in
the country, would make any limits very difficult to administer and enforce.
Collectors cited the effect of any limits on the authenticity and value of collectible
firearms and certain magazines, some of which are extremely valuable. Compensation has not
been offered by the government, but this would seem to be out of the question in any case
because of the sums that would probably be required. The Department of Justice has
suggested that magazines designed for certain non-semi-automatic firearms, but which fit
some modern semi-automatics, such as the 10-shot Lee-Enfield, would be exempted. This
would deal with some of the concerns of users of Lee-Enfields, but the interests of collectors
are much larger. The Special Committee is of the view that large capacity magazines are not a
danger to public safety in the hands of properly-defined and regulated gun collectors.
The Special Committee is concerned that the actual limits proposed by the government
are unnecessarily low, and would detrimentally affect legitimate shooting sports that pose no
danger to public safety. The Committee is also skeptical that limits based purely on the size of
the magazine would be workable. We thus propose that the limits be larger, that they be tied
to the activities engaged in by the user, and that special authorization be required for the
acquisition of magazines in excess of our proposed basic limit. In particular, we believe that
hunters should be permitted to use up to 10-shot magazines, competition shooters up to 20-
shot magazines, and that genuine gun collectors be unrestricted. These limits could be
imposed by way of restrictions placed on the sale ofmagazines, and authorizations to purchase magazines larger than those permitted would be specified
on the FAC or restricted weapon registration certificate of the owner seeking the magazines. As 10-
round magazines would be permitted for hunting and all other purposes, the restrictions would apply
only to magazines with a capacity larger than 10.



http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/pol-leg/pdf/c80-eng.pdf
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peter527
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Lun 1 Juin 2015 - 15:29

1 cd cest juste ma facon dinterpretter leur petit changement et leur memo qui dise etre une annee de changement a ce qui concerne les chargeurs
Pour ce qui est des procureurs je me fi pas trop la dessus ont a eu deja de belle example comme en 2012 la poursuite
pour arme non retreinte non enregistrer malgre le fait que le code criminel avait deja ete amender et surment dautre aussi que je me souvient pas mon opignion
je comprend la tienne aussi la grc peu se faire revirer de bors par un procureur qui a du bon sense ou par le gouvernement federal parce que il ne sont pas la pour changer l interprettation ou modifier le texte de loi
mais rien nest couler dans le beton surtous si le npd ou les liberal rentre cette annee
ecrit a partir dun cell dsl pour la ponctuation
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1clickdown
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Lun 1 Juin 2015 - 19:26

On est sur la même fréquence peter527. Very Happy
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DT741
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Lun 1 Juin 2015 - 20:43

Y a vraiment du monde dans vie qui veulent pas que les autres aillent de fun... Pathétique move de la GRC encore

Un ptit e-mail ET une ptite lettre a Blaney d'envoyer !!! Voici les informations pour ceux/celles qui font pas juste chialer derrière un clavier pis qui s'implique dans la cause.

The Honourable Steven Blaney
Email:steven.blaney@parl.gc.ca

Hill Office
House of Commons
Ottawa, Ontario
Canada
K1A 0A6

Telephone: 613-992-7434
Fax: 613-995-6856

Mail may be sent postage-free to any Member of Parliament.

Constituency Office(s)
115 President Kennedy Road (Main Office)
Suite 101
Lévis, Québec
G6V 6C8
Telephone: 418-830-0500
Fax: 418-830-0504
1516-D Route 277
Lac-Etchemin, Québec
G0R 1S0
Telephone: 418-625-2626
Fax: 418-625-4663

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BoomSticK
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Mer 3 Juin 2015 - 16:33

This very clear statement from Minister Blaney's office:

“Our Conservative Government is committed to safe and sensible firearms policies. The regulations governing firearms magazines are clear - the maximum permitted capacity of a magazine is determined by the kind of firearm it is designed or manufactured for use in and not the kind of firearm it might actually be used in. No changes have been made to those regulations, none are currently planned, and none will be made that negatively impact the property rights of law-abiding gun owners”

Traduction google.

Cette déclaration très claire du bureau du ministre Blaney:

«Notre gouvernement conservateur est déterminé à les politiques sécuritaires et d'armes à feu sensibles. Les règlements régissant les armes à feu magazines sont clairs - la capacité maximale autorisée d'un magazine est déterminé par le type d'arme à feu, il est conçu ou fabriqué pour être utilisé dans et pas le genre d'arme à feu, il pourrait en fait être utilisé dans Aucun changement n'a été apporté à ceux. la réglementation, aucun sont actuellement prévus, et ne seront pas faits qui ont un impact négatif sur les droits de propriété des propriétaires d'armes à feu respectueux de la loi "
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1clickdown
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MessageSujet: Re: LAR-15 , Beowulf , bientot limite?    Mer 3 Juin 2015 - 16:54

^^^ Cool Excellent!!!!
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